PODCAST EPISODE 251: Real Estate Rent or Sell? Tips on Getting Started

 

WHAT WAS COVERED

      • 00:00 – Episode begins Paul welcomes listeners.
      • 01:10 – Paul sets up topics for the episode.
      • 02:48 – Article Breakdown: In a Slowing Housing Market, Sellers Ask: Why List a Home When You Can Collect Rent?
      • 12:08 – Article Breakdown: Startup Firms Help Home Buyers Win Bidding Wars With All-Cash Offers.
      • 17:30 – The Final Article: 5 tips for getting started in the current real estate market
      • 31:10 – Closing thoughts
      • 32:17 – Episode ends, thank you for listening.

 

 

LINKS

Article: In a Slowing Housing Market, Sellers Ask: Why List a Home When You Can Collect Rent? (WSJ)

Article: Startup Firms Help Home Buyers Win Bidding Wars With All-Cash Offers (WSJ)

Article: A 34-year-old who bought 53 investment properties this year shares his top 5 tips for getting started in the current real estate market. (Apple News)

Referenced Podcast Episode: PODCAST EPISODE 183 – What Is Your ROR On Home Equity? (Part 1) 

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Full Episode Transcription


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0:05

Hello sound financial family welcome to your business, your wealth. My name is Paul Adams. I’m so glad to have you here. We are recently arriving in 4k to all of you today. Oh, and feel tingly on my skin? I know. Well, the funny thing is, I didn’t realize that in our whole video software. And this is why people want us for my financial mind, not for my technical skills. Because after months and months and months and months of doing episodes, I found out there’s this setting.


0:33

I wanted every time i i Did one of the uploads to YouTube on like a kid’s video or some else requested always standard definition not HD. Well, everybody now you know that we are HD that means?


0:46

Does that mean we


0:47

actually look like?


0:50

And we don’t charge any extra for being able to look in the pores. Right? So that’s good. And Cory, I got to say you have a new nickname that our audience likes quite a bit. It’s been mentioned in the comments is that the man with the wisdom of Solomon, but the Gerber Baby face?


1:07

Oh, is that what is resonating


1:11

with with that we have a fun set of conversations with you guys today. And it’s mainly because corner just going to go back and forth a little bit and talk about some of the major things that are in the news around real estate, and how some of those real estate things can really impact your financial future, what you may want to invest in and for those of you that considering going into real estate talking about some of the pitfalls, but we’re going to be doing it right out of looking at the current the things that we read into every single day. And so, Cory I think we’re hitting it as slowing out here, get the guy who bought a lot of properties and then start up home buying firm. Well, we’re gonna find that. That last one actually in the first one. Yeah, so we’re gonna follow that through. Yeah. Okay, cool. So just one i One thought experiment to do is, I’m going to talk about real estate now. But let’s just say anything you read about and then in the news, like Apple news, your Facebook feed, and it’s like, oh, yeah, that might be a really good opportunity to invest in. Well, that might already be the time it was too late for whatever this magical opportunity is, by the time that millions of other people are already reading it right next to you. If you guys find a good article you’d like to see us talk about, just put it in the comments on the YouTube video, or email us at info at SF g way.com. And we’ll jump on it and look at it and see if we some of the articles we presented if you guys are consistent listeners who’ve kind of done shout outs to our some of our clients and some of our listeners who have actually contributed to the show by being able to send us one of those articles. So our first one today is this article is in a slowing housing market. Sellers ask why list a home when you can collect rent.


3:02

Now, the basics of this, are people are looking at the fact like okay, I’m going to move from this home to this other home. But I’m worried about this softening housing market. So maybe I just rent my current home and find my down payment elsewhere or put down less was that a fair summary for? Yeah. So now here’s the biggest thing that we notice, I think so Cory, I’ll give I notice it. And then you can speak for whether or not our other advisors bump into this. But it’s that these these houses that you own, you look at the payment only, which is like your insurance and taxes, etc. And you say, Oh, this is costing me $2,675 a month.


3:51

And then you look around you say wow. But there’s rents in my neighborhood where they’re getting


3:57

3700. So I’m gonna make a little over $1,000 a month, something like that. And that seems good.


4:04

But there’s also something that makes this seem extra good.


4:10

And why it feels extra good is I can get $1,000 a month of passive cash flow. For many of you listening, you’re, you’re working a job, you’re, you know, eight to five, that’s when you can make your money. You can’t like go read a book that night and get paid more tomorrow. Right? So the ability to generate income that generates for you even though it takes some effort, but it’s outside of your regular role, even if you’re making four or $500,000 a year. It is really attractive, it is seductive to take a look, go $1,000 A month that I’m not having to show up to work for no question that is attractive, and that’s usually where the math stops for everybody.


4:52

But the thing that has to be considered is how much money do we have in this thing called the house?


4:57

Because even though you may be putting


5:00

Down $20,000 when you bought that home, and now it’s doubled in value, that’s not the return that you would calculate. And you guys can see some of this in, especially in our episode 183. What is the rate of return on your home equity?


5:15

Oh, yeah, it’s good one. Oh, yeah. Right, because at 184 After that’s kind of part two, but this idea being that when you have a home, if that home has 200,000, a value locked into it, like if I sold it, subtract out any transaction fees, real estate agent, Medicare tax, whatever your county does to you, take all that out, I have a good rubric is eight, eight and a half percent is what’s gonna cost you unload property, then you know what your real equity is. So boom, I got my equity, say 200,000. Now, that $1,000 a month sounds really good, no question. And it comes down to be a 6% rate of return. If there’s no overhead, no vacancy in the property, and our rental management company, I rent it myself.


6:04

I handle the repairs.


6:07

Right, and nobody ever leaves. So now you start calculating some of the repairs that are always needed on real estate, you start looking at, you know, the fact there may be a little bit of vacancy over the years, and suddenly you $1,000 A month very, very quickly with just a little bit of assessment looks a lot like $700 A month or $500 a month when all costs are counted in. Right? Well, now your rate of return on renting that property is 3%.


6:34

And in less what you’re doing is banking on a hope and a promise that appreciation is gonna save the day.


6:41

And and condos are notoriously less appreciative than, than homes and homes in general rise with inflation over the long term. And people forget that because we’ve had a big run over the last couple years. But over the last 50 We’re so fallen back to those long term, long term averages. You got it? So 3% $1,000 a month feels a lot more than 3%. Yeah, right. Yeah. Like it hits the brain in a different way. Well, yeah. And the other thing is, that’s different that I want to acknowledge that is so very seductive about real estate is you only have really after you buy the property, you only end up with one ball one real volatility event. Right? When I sell and sell it, yeah, it’s no, I can look at my stock market portfolio. And I can see what every single security of 14,000 securities is worth today, not just today. Like we could go look right now. And we’re like, this is just about every minute, every minute, I can see volatility. Yeah, and so real estate in and of itself feels safer. Because they just see the volatility at the very end.


7:51

It that feels safe. And it also feels safe. Because I bought a home 10 years ago, it doubled in value over 10 years. And that feels like a huge amount of money because one volatility event.


8:03

Except that was like a 7% rate of return, which isn’t bad. Don’t get me wrong. That’s not a bad rate of return.


8:11

But when you look at doubling, and that’s the only volatility event you noticed, and it wasn’t like you could dollar cost average into the house. So it’s very clear what I put into it originally. If I want I could correct for repairs over that period of time. But bottom line is, it’s very attractive because of its


8:27

appearance of low volatility. Yeah. And yet, you know, as Korean have talked about the past, real estate is the only asset you can hold on your balance sheet that can hold the rest of your balance sheet hostage because it needs a new roof.


8:42

It is unique in that, and we, you know, we have lots of clients that do own rental real estate, I want to be clear, we’re not saying it’s a bad thing to own. It’s a bad thing to own without assessing the opportunity fully. Yes, I would put it and you know, there’s also I’ve made a comment about following a trend. I don’t think there’s ever a particularly good or bad time to invest in real estate so much as good or bad time for for you and following a fad is usually the bad time. That’s really I think a better way to say it. Ooh, that’s that is well said because I think about it too. Not only is your balance sheet have to be squared away but then you as a human being need to know how to run this little business called Real Estate. So consider if you’re thinking about renting your home you’re in now and as far as you’ve gotten in your real estate research is reading this article.


9:41

You may want to read a book


9:45

for before you go on the hook for a quarter million dollars if it’s quarter million dollar loan. Right like I mean that like maybe I mean the Bible it talks about count the cost before going to war like just totally count the cost before going into housing


10:00

But it is interesting because I do want to speak to this just briefly quarry number of homeless things that were delisted without going under contract rose 58%. So we’re starting to see that inventory build in real estate, which that inventory building, almost it’s only outcome is an increase in supply is a decrease in


10:23

demand. That’s it. So if the supplies go up, because people are D listing homes, and home sellers, home builders, giving more incentives and dropping prices, that’s gonna affect when you sell your home. But that doesn’t mean you’re always better off doing a rental, and I wouldn’t be married to your low interest rate, do the math of your actual return on equity, the way we talked about earlier, if you need help, how to do that, then, I don’t know, just email us your data of here’s what I can get rent, here’s what my home costs every month. All that and we’ll shoot a quick video and send back to you just for being a listener.


11:02

So talk about following a trend if the only reason that you’re renting out your your house is that you don’t want to sell it for what you feel is a depressed price right now. And the rent feels really good. Well think about if it seems like there’s a lot more people feeling that way. So maybe right now you you rent it, and your first lease is good. But a year from now, there’s been so much more opportunity to rent like rents are dropping like crazy, because everyone’s offering their places for rent. You may not be able to sustain that for the long term. Yep. So there’s, you know, following that, following that fad, and this goes back, right, before we go to our next topic, this goes right back to that idea, control your capital, check your rate of return.


11:52

And make sure that that next move is actually getting you closer to your long term financial aims. Doesn’t matter how good the spreadsheet looks, what matters is, well, that gets somebody closer to their aims of the future. That’s, that’s it. So one thing that came up that I love that you noticed, Cory in this article is down here at the bottom was this link is that there’s this new tool that allows people to buy before they sell, or buy without selling at all.


12:24

Well, that looked interesting. So we clicked on it.


12:27

And this is what we saw.


12:31

We found that there’s this company out there. And some of you may have even read this article, that there’s a company out there that for depending they have a few different financial models. And I don’t know about you guys, but as as we’re talking with you, for me, I get hung up if I don’t know how they make money. Somebody says I got this new offer. I’m like, great. Tell me how it makes money first, then I can start to make an assessment about whether that’s something I want to engage on, you know, what rules you’re playing by? Yeah. And what was the total? They said you had to be their mortgage broker, they had to be your broker, or they had to be pierced agent. Or they charge you. Right? And what they’re doing, maybe explain it first. I didn’t tell.


13:14

Right. So here’s the problem a lot of people have faced in trying to buy a house lately, there’s a lot of cash offers coming to the table. So someone’s got a mortgage, and they’re getting out not even outbid sometimes but same price just Oh, it’s a cat. It’s a full cash offer. And the seller doesn’t have to deal with your financing and and so cash offers are just flooding in and getting getting all the wins on these battles. So there’s companies that have come in to say, we’ll help you look like you’re an all cash offer. And what that actually means is they’re ending up doing your mortgage, but they’re fronting cash to the seller, or they might even be buying the property themselves and then selling it to you. But it’s an all cash offer on the on the outside. All it is is a mortgage that doesn’t look like a mortgage to the seller. That’s all it is. It’s not anything really new. But but it’s the classic example of the financial industry coming in with a one off solution. Just like what’s the what’s the mutual fund we just saw on the in the ads like the Vanek.


14:27

That was awesome. It was see I hope that ad is still there. I’m gonna show everybody Yes, it is. This is at Quarry mode. Oh yeah. Van Eck Morningstar wide moat ETF ditch style biases, true stock. So like, it’s like the active managers, active managers.


14:46

But here’s, I don’t know if we could ever figure out if this is true or not, but my hunch is it’s a fund that they’ve had for a while that maybe the hasn’t been doing as well until lately or they or they just added this name moat to it or just grew.


15:00

You named it because people are worried the markets down. So like you need a moat, but a year ago it was you need an arrow pointing to this guy Arrow. Arrow fun. Yeah.


15:15

Probably while they’re changing what indexes they compare themselves to, allegedly, allegedly, we have no idea if there’s mode ETF has done that, but I think Corey just promised our entire audience, he would check into that and get back to us in our next episode. I don’t know about the rest of you out there. That’s when I heard, please put something in the comments that you agree.


15:39

That’s okay. I got that deep fake stuff Miranda has been working on so she’s gonna just put you in there and put me in there. Yeah, yep. So whatever. Cool. So so this idea of the financial institution swoops in says, Hey, we can make you that all cash offer, it works real good in this moment. But the second the, all the like, fervor around this housing market, tamps down, I don’t know how that startup firms gonna get by, in fact, I’m going to just try me to reach out to the founders of this company, they’re up here in the Pacific Northwest, and just see what their plans are after and see if he talked about on the podcast. I mean, it’s a clever idea. And from one side of the coin, it could be an amazing thing to promote, like, reduce the gap of economic inequality, to just say, you know, like, the same number amount of dollars is coming to buy this house. But just because it’s all cash versus financing. That’s usually folks with more income coming from others. Like, there could be some really cool things about this. I do worry about a startup like this and their success long term, if this just this way. So yeah. And for all of you listening, I don’t you know, normally you think about an extra Dragon, a financial transaction would be bad. But this could prevent a 10% escalation in a bidding war. Yeah, so it’s a little bit like you’re buying some insurance. And I would imagine, if nobody accepts your offer, you don’t owe this company anything.


17:11

Right. So any, for those of you looking that that might be helpful for that, we’ll have a link to this article in the in the show notes, so you can take a look at it. Put a comment down, if you check them out. We’d love to we just love hearing from the audience and what you’re saying about our stuff. Because we do love bringing it to you. All right, you’re ready for our final one. The one that I think I am going to rant the most on really grand piano sound effect of like both barnel article?


17:43

No, yeah, well, we’ll just clip that. I think we should just clip that Miranda will use that exact sound effect for the remainder of our entire podcast. Yes. For ever. We’re now going to use it. Bah, bah, bah. But I thought you were going to have a sound effect. And we could have some kind of like what grinds Paul’s gears like a jingle?


18:06

I don’t know, maybe just a little too much Family Guy when I was a kid. Okay.


18:11

So the title of this article is 34 year old purchases 53 properties this year, shares how to invest.


18:21

So, number one, first and foremost, just congratulations.


18:28

Because I’m pretty sure he bought all 53 homes on the money he saved at the hairstylist.


18:34

Easy, all right.


18:39

I get cheap hair cut. I know what to look like. You don’t have to kick a guy in the knots when he can’t fight back. Like it’s not it’s no bad. Corey, I don’t have to. But I get to, and I take it seriously.


18:54

I’m only slightly more inflammatory than usual, just this much more, so much more. Here’s what I get from the title of the article. Step one, buy not just one property, like if you’re gonna get into the real estate, investing business, how about some diversification and he’s he’s spreading his money around to a lot of different properties. It also, you know, a lot of people are catching on to this rental game. Margins are thin, as they say. So, you know, you could buy one property for two or $300 a month of net gain. But that doesn’t make you a lot of money. You got to buy 53 properties and make a few 100 bucks a month on each of them to actually have a start to be a meaningful amount of revenue for you. Yes, so it’s telling. Yep. And and he does, but I am going to continue to make fun of him because he’s 34 years old. And he bought 34 properties in a year. So I think that 5353 My apologies 53 properties this year with his terrible haircut but I


20:00

I’m going to give this guy a hard time, just like he’s one of my buddies hanging out who bought 53 properties. And I’m gonna be like, That is awesome. Now we’re gonna pick your bones clean


20:11

on every other thing we could pick on because you bought 53 properties last year. So I’m just going to treat him as one of my good friends and give him that business. So here’s some of the main things he talks about as tips in owning the real estate. And the thing that’s not said in this quarry that I think is important for us to bring up. You can tell if you get a chance to read this article, which Miranda, if you would, could you just make sure one of those other links that Corey found, we found that this article, you actually can’t access directly unless you have Apple news. So we’ll make sure there’s a link to like there’s a couple other places this article is without a paywall. So the beginning talks a little bit about the real estate market, then it’s, you know, people are sitting on the sidelines waiting for stability, but he bought 53 properties. But this is key. He’s been doing it since 2014. So let’s do that math. If he’s 34. Now 2014, eight years. So he’s been doing this since he’s 26.


21:15

He has been doing this half of his adult life.


21:20

Now, that’s going back to Korea’s original comment that I think is so key. And I think this is the key everybody needs to hold on to you got to treat real estate, like a business.


21:30

Real Estate and real estate. Obviously, it’s not a side hustle. That’s right, that’s full on business. And we tell our clients that all the time, one of the most important things you could do is when you buy a rental property or buying a business, it has a customer or if it’s multi unit as customers, it’s got overhead as expenses. It has volatility has risk. And you should be assessing all of those things no differently than you would if you’re buying a Baskin Robbins for cash flow. So


21:57

he


21:59

and what I also like to give you an idea, the seriousness of this, say young man, I don’t know that early onset Fuddy duddies really messing with me Cory 53rd property is an apartment complex in 19 units. So he’s got a lot more than 53 doors acquired this year. Yeah. And he’s worked, he’s flipped, he’s done wholesale properties, etc. So these are his five tips. And I think they all point toward that idea that what you should do when you approach real estate is think of it like you’re buying a little business.


22:30

So I really like a lot of his tips, you know, to it’s taking the it’s fortunately taken the glamour out of it, which is what most businesses are but you know, shy away from luxury properties, anything above a million, the you’re just gonna have fewer potential buyers for it. So that I love that like, get into the sweet spot of a first time homebuyer. So he’s, he’s getting in with the exit strategy in mind, which is brilliant, I really, I really appreciate that perspective. The quote that came right after that, that I liked is from the gentleman the articles about, which by the way, I do want to give him some props because he has a podcast


23:11

that you guys could check out ordinary guys extraordinary wealth, real estate investing and passive income tactics, they have some kind of online course that they sell about how to buy real estate.


23:22

He said you want as normal and ordinary as possible, you want a three bed, two bath rectangular ranch property. Now you can do two stories, you can do more, you can do less, but the majority are buyers are going to be for those properties.


23:38

Next, he says and this, this is like music to my ears. Somebody telling people to invest in real estate, that they need to get positive cash flow. Because several, I mean, gosh, it’s more than several times a year, me Korean Jeff will meet a client who’s just working with a real regular real estate agent to try to help them buy their first rental home.


24:06

And that’s okay. But then you need to be equipped with enough knowledge, right? If somebody’s going to show you homes, but they’re not somebody that buys properties with a decent capitalization rate with a decent amount of positive cash flow on a consistent basis. It’s okay to use a realtor that’s not doing that. But then you have to be the one who’s learned from people who are doing it successfully.


24:30

So positive cash flow every single time


24:34

counting for vacancy we talked about that earlier vacancy of five to 10% of the rent.


24:41

Then consider wholesaling. This is a little bit more complex. That’s where you enter into a contract to buy a home at a set price. And then you basically relist the house and sell your contract to somebody else.


24:59

So but that


25:00

A whole different ballgame. And that’s like a job, like you are in action all the time. There’s nothing passive about that.


25:08

And then make sure that the upgrades you’re doing on a home if you’re improving it either to rent, which by the way, in his book, long distance real estate investing, Robert Greene talks about this idea that if you buy something that needs to be fixed, and then you fix it up, but only to rental standards,


25:29

because a renter has a different standard for the countertops they want, than somebody who’s going to move in with a family too.


25:38

And so, yeah, you can, you could do more economical, rehabbing on the house that you’re going to rent one to you have less money in it, which means your return on equity is better.


25:52

So upgrade upgrades, all that limited to quick fixes. And then make sure that you have strong relationships and open lines of communication. This is the part that most people miss, you know, if you’re a means if you’re making top 1% income north of 350 400 a year, then you need a team just to handle your own finances, you know, you need a CPA or an accountant, you got to have an advisor, probably an attorney, especially if you’re a business owner. But when you go into real estate game, now look at the people you need, you got to have a good relationship with contractors where that property is banks, lenders. And I would even say it may be property management firms for many of you because this guy is doing it full time all the time.


26:37

But if you’re not doing it full time, all the time, you may not want to get phone call, to then have to send somebody out to fix something.


26:45

That I think that’s one of the things a lot of people leave out real estate investing is the complication. And you can avoid that disappointment around complication if you do what this gentleman has done, which what’s his name?


26:58

Sam, Sam Prem. So what Sam has done is he’s made it a business


27:05

53 properties here that’s closing on like that, literally more than one a week. Like, I’m wondering how many he’s sold, that the article doesn’t say that. Yeah, he does talk about flipping a lot. So some of them he may be keeping for cash flow, but I think he’s flipping a lot, I’d be curious to know how many actually sold as well? Well, there’s something in here that hinted at me with that what he might be doing is renting them for a year.


27:32

And then selling it for long term cap gains.


27:35

He’s fixing that’d be clever editing, and flipping it for CAP gains. So that long term cap gains, you know, if you’re in a state or a place where you’re paying 35%, taxes, 20% is a lot better if you’re in a high income plus cap gains. So here’s what we want you guys to take away, you are gonna get so much information. Now right now, a lot of it’s unreal estate, because it’s on everybody’s mind, the prices have gone up a lot, the stock markets down. So people are saying, Oh, maybe I should move into this other thing.


28:07

And it’s the thing that I can’t say enough. You alluded to it earlier, Cory just the idea that we’re not against anybody doing real estate. We have lots of clients to do with lots of clients, they bought their first rental properties, after our mentorship and work with them to help them prepare both themselves mentally, like, learn enough, and arrange their balance sheet in a way that it’s safe enough for them to do.


28:33

And then they get into first property. So we’re not against it. But you just have to know that just like people watching the real estate movement of price, and then think oh my gosh, was this means now’s the time to buy or not buy, you are putting your speculative training that Wall Street has done to all of us and you’re now applying it to another thing that is not an investment. You could put money in Tesla come back in three years and see what it’s worth.


29:03

This is a little business requires you be active you be available, you keep your finances in certain shape, so that these things can really pay out their best because here’s the major problem with all this stuff in real estate. Now. I think the same thing goes for people that are speculative in stock trading, etc. But the problem is you guys, we never see Korean I rarely see it.


29:26

You might never see it is the person that really burns down and loses their tail.


29:32

Because everybody’s staring at a cockatoo. Yeah, right. Would you like if let’s just picture somebody you’re at a party with or networking function with


29:42

got over leveraged in real estate five years ago, lost everything doesn’t have custody their kids because it drove him to drink. Right? Like all the stuff that could come along because when you lose you’re in real estate.


29:58

We might need a bleep when you lose your


30:00

In real estate, you


30:03

you lose a lot more than just the value of your accounts.


30:09

You can lose credit rating, NEC P all these things have faded from 2008 people’s credits back fixed and they’re feeling good. Nobody’s got stories not being able to buy homes anymore. And lo and behold, a whole new market pops up. Why? Because our members too short.


30:25

So get yourself educated about real estate engage, maybe go check out Sam’s podcast and his


30:33

his course, maybe that would help you. But if nothing else, we’ve also had clients, we’ve made them fully aware of everything it takes to be a landlord and a real estate investor. And they went whoa, I thought I just had to buy another house.


30:46

And they don’t do it for good for not because we convinced them, but because they just we gave them a taste of what life was going to be like owning this real estate. And after getting the taste of it, they were like, I don’t know that I want my future to look like that.


31:01

So when other people taste it, and they say that, yeah, give me some more. And listen more than that. That’s good. Yeah, that’s right. Yep. And if and if you can hold on to him. And remember the biggest thing about investing in real estate is positioning your balance sheet in a way that you never have to sell a property you never have to be forced to sell a property because that will make all the difference in the world more to come on a future podcast I’m sure glad that the whole sound financial family could join us here today.


31:31

Once you to know guys we really appreciate all of you it means the world


31:36

to me when I hear that you guys enjoyed the episode.


31:40

Full disclosure Corey doesn’t care if you guys like him or not, but I


31:47

it’s so weird that like when you guys do a subscribe when you guys give a thumbs up when you do a comment, it makes a difference because it gives a chance for somebody else to see this who may not have and we’re now releasing YouTube shorts. So don’t forget to go to our Channel and see all of our little short form content. So when you just have a minute, and you just going through Paul withdrawals. You just go ahead and click on one of those little YouTube shorts and with that, we hope that this episode has been a contribution to you being able to design and build a good life


 


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PRODUCTION CREDITS

Podcast production and show notes by Greater North Productions LLC