PODCAST EPISODE 169: ARE YOU GROUNDING YOUR ASSESSMENTS WITH KARI GRANGER

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Unknown Speaker 0:00

Many of us are paid for our assessments you know, you hire me because I have expert assessments about leadership about organizational alignment about strategy, creation and execution. You hire me for my assessments. I just want to be clear when I’m hearing assessments coming at me and when I’m making them and how much they impact my imagination my decisions in my actions.

Paul 0:25

Welcome to your business, your wealth, or your host, Paul Adams and Corey Shepard teach founders and entrepreneurs how to build wealth beyond their business balance sheets. Hi.

Unknown Speaker 0:47

I’m Stephan. And

Unknown Speaker 0:49

there is no

Cory 0:53

light pen and sappy is how Hello and welcome Come to your business your wealth. I’m Corey Shepherd, president of sound Financial Group and your co host on this podcast along with a man who is so organized he even schedules his speeding tickets in advance. Mr. Paul Adams. Thank you so

Paul 1:15

much. I think right there is where we should insert the canned like a mega applause, both for my introduction and for that incredibly creative introduction scheduling my speeding tickets. If anybody ever gave me a speeding ticket, and I wasn’t able to navigate my way out of them, I would accept that as a moniker it’s a

Cory 1:36

I brought that up because I knew you couldn’t resist saying something about getting out in speeding tickets.

Unknown Speaker 1:42

Yep, I was Matter of fact, I’m gonna

Unknown Speaker 1:45

hold on. How many speeding tickets? Have you gotten out? Because I might have you beat

Paul 1:50

like four in the last year.

Cory 1:52

Okay, do you know that?

Unknown Speaker 1:54

I’m at 13 lifetime. Wow. All

Paul 1:58

right. Well, now we’ve got more Come with Carrie but I do want to let all of our listeners in on a tidbit I did not think I would talk about today and that is how to both honor and respect a police officer and potentially escape a ticket and that is and Carrie you may have an extra one because we may just blow out our time limit on this episode we’ll see what happens is when they pull up to the car, all interior lights on windows down car shut off hands where they can see them kind of higher on the steering wheel tended to and when they come up to the window, super respectful, making sure that they’re okay with me getting my registration. And when they say Do you know why I stopped you? I look at them and say well, probably because I’m speeding because I I do try to do it safely but I speed a lot and I know that you’ve got no option but to give me a ticket. I’m just super Sorry for the inconvenience officer.

Unknown Speaker 2:55

Like so similar. I mean

Paul 2:59

I will introduce you in a second. First you have to share about what you say, Oh, good.

Unknown Speaker 3:04

Yes. I think that hopefully me over I’m like, Wow, thank you. You are You’re right. I was speeding and you know, I just think you thank you for doing that.

Unknown Speaker 3:16

Nice. I you know, and then they just, they just don’t take it. You’re after that.

Unknown Speaker 3:21

No, they don’t. I mean, I come from like, it’s total integrity, right. Like, you’re right. I, I was going too fast. And, you know, thank you for bringing that to my attention. I’m, I’m grateful for that.

Paul 3:33

I dash a little like, Scott Adams, Dr. Cellini persuasion on top to just simply say, and I know you’ve got no option. I love that give me a ticket. Because one thing if you guys know we know and love our police officers got one as a neighbor, every time I tell them that they’re like, yeah, you’re right. That totally activates us because one thing we do love on patrol is our autonomy of what we do in enforcement. And so they, when you tell them you I know you haven’t No option. You gotta like reverse

Unknown Speaker 4:01

like,

Paul 4:02

I’ll show you. I’ll show you that was an unplanned departure. Why don’t I introduce

Cory 4:11

Kappa I didn’t even know we’re gonna have anyone else here like who is this other voice talking to us right? No. Terry

Paul 4:18

undefeated in getting a speeding ticket round 13 times running World Champion, also special guest on episode 73 on culture bombings and leadership which we’ll touch on just briefly this episode, also a co host with me have another podcast one that you should absolutely consume and give to your leadership teams in your organization’s called leadership impact leadership impact takes really complex, potentially complex ways of thinking around leadership. And I as Kerry’s resident caveman, help translate some of that into real world and frankly, most of the time I’m just Ear candy, talking back and forth with Carrie so that you guys have someone else to also listen to on that podcast because she takes the cake one of the world’s leaders in leadership training and being able to transform organizations from the top down. And a good friend of mine, Kerry Granger. Welcome to your business your wealth.

Unknown Speaker 5:22

Thank you, Paul. And Cory, so happy to be here. Well, again, I have one other way. I’m ready.

Paul 5:30

One more ticket thing. I’m ready.

Unknown Speaker 5:31

Yeah, yeah, don’t speed.

Unknown Speaker 5:33

Well,

Unknown Speaker 5:36

man, Jordan, we’ll just cut that I was.

Unknown Speaker 5:41

So leaving that

Cory 5:43

I’m missing something here. Now Actually,

Paul 5:45

that’s a great transition for us about making well grounded assessments. Perhaps being able to see solutions where other people don’t see them. I never had occurred to me to stop speeding. I just I just went looked at it as it’s like there’s a toll for speeding that they periodically pulled me over and attempt to assess the toll. But

Unknown Speaker 6:07

I mean, four times in the last year and a half is kind of a lot.

Paul 6:10

Yeah, well, I don’t drive that much. And I don’t drive in cities only on highways. I don’t know how to drive. I don’t speed anywhere, but highways, because hitting people crossing the street does freak me out. With that. Let’s talk about grounding assessments. Now. For those of you that don’t know, a little bit of extra background on Carrie is her company. The Granger network does consulting and coaching but inside of large organizations, so we’re talking billion dollar plus market capitalization organizations. So one of the reasons why I love being able to have her here, because unless you were lucky enough to be inside one of those billion dollar organizations, or you happen to be at a conference somewhere that has paid her to do a keynote, you’re likely otherwise never going to get content from Like we’re going to go into today. And it’s why we wanted to bring Carrie just kind of right here to your EarPods giving you some new ways of thinking about assessments and making well grounded assessments. So maybe just start with Carrie, can we kick off with just what is an assessment?

Unknown Speaker 7:18

Yeah, and and why, right. Why would we talk about it? Yeah, so there’s, you know, there’s really assessments or Prabhat grounding assessments, this thing we’re going to talk about is probably one of two Keystone skills that I see make the biggest difference and are yet one of the most missing skills that we have. And so grounding assessments. If I could only work with executives for one day to do one kind of training, it would be grounding assessments.

Paul 7:52

Right on okay. Now, what is that Think assessment is one of those words that people walk around you say, do you know what an assessment is? They would go Yes.

Cory 8:04

Yeah, of course. Yeah, I know what that is. But if we’re gonna

Paul 8:07

perform it, tell me what an assessment is. And people would be like grasping for what? Well, what is the definition? And so maybe we just start there.

Unknown Speaker 8:17

Yeah, so, you know, it’s assessments is a aspect of how we talk and how we think about the world. And it’s, it’s more in the domain of our subjective perceptions or pretends pinions. The problem is that most of us think that we act and interact with facts and data and, and what’s so it couldn’t be further from the truth. We only ever act and interact with our interpretations or assessments about what so like even the data, you know, some people say no, totally data driven leader. Good, what data do you Choose to look at completely subjective, you know, why decide to look at these five pieces? And not those four pieces? Right? So what animated that choice was an assessment you have about what’s valuable and what’s not valuable. So assessments are at the very core of our decisions and our actions. And it’s something that we don’t see. In fact,

Paul 9:23

we don’t even see we’re doing it. Well, you know, critique that we’re doing it well or not.

Unknown Speaker 9:28

So the thing is, is we actually speak I believe, 90 to 95% of what comes out of our mouth is assessments. And we don’t even know it. We think it’s facts. We think it’s recounting we think it’s inventing is creative, but it’s it’s mostly assessments. And the point is not to stop doing that. Because many of us are paid for our assessments. You know, you hire me because I have expert assessments about leadership about organizational learning. And about strategy creation and execution, you hire me for my assessments. I just want to be clear when I’m hearing assessments coming at me, and when I’m making them and how much they impact my imagination, my decisions and my actions.

Unknown Speaker 10:16

Now, really,

Cory 10:18

yeah, I want you to what you’re telling me, this world class coach, and we’ve got this recorded is like when my wife says something to me something like, man, the garbage is really getting full. Well, that’s just that’s her assessment. I can tell her that, you know, very funny. Well, that is your assessment. And then

Paul 10:39

and then you could know that

Cory 10:41

I’m not going to try that. But right, I’ll have to get a plane ticket, and it’ll be but so that would never be a recommendation for any spouse to say to the others. But that is an example in our daily lives where one that’s speaking in assessment now she actually has a request that she says that too. Take out the garbage, like that’s underneath it. But what we hear from people most often first is the assessments that are coming out totally.

Unknown Speaker 11:09

And you might find, you know, part of grounding and assessment, even in that example, is you could do this as long as you weren’t certainly plastic in doing right, you know, the mood makes a big difference, right. But you could be like, wow, you know, I, I don’t actually see it as getting full. So, honey, just so I know, and I can do this better. We’re kind of what’s your criteria for full now that sounds kind of sarcastic. But you might be asking, like how once it gets to where you want it out, right, because that’s what’s happening is you have different criteria for the assessment called getting full. Yeah, my

Cory 11:48

pain point is a lot higher on that can. Yeah, exactly.

Paul 11:52

Yeah. So I’m having a bit of a Aha, and maybe bordering on a breakthrough so fast in episode I know that was surprising. I know. And that was even with all that was luck. But the mere fact that my wife, or business partner or vendor, or whoever, says something, and I can pause for a minute and say, because it’s so easy for us to relate to it is, that is a fact they’re stating in the wrong. And it has us break relationship, even if it’s just in our own mind as we try to think of the quote unquote, right thing to say in response. But if instead if every time my wife were to say, here’s the garbage, or somebody tells me, we’ve got too much cash in the business, something like that, to just understand that’s their assessment actually allows me to better understand them just by simply and everybody else is speaking, realizing they’re making assessments.

Unknown Speaker 12:55

So good, Paul. Exactly. Because what most people do is They what you said they now argue, like, No, we don’t have too much cash in the business. But what they don’t notice is no, I have an assessment and you have an assessment. So what do we do? We need to ground our assessments, meaning, we need to find out what criteria are you using to say we got too much cash? What criteria Am I using to say we got too much cash other thing what you said, and we’ll go into that a little bit more. But the other thing that you said that’s so good, I didn’t even think we would talk about it on this episode was assessments or windows into what people fundamentally care about. So when somebody says we have too much cash in the in the business, you can say, wow, there’s two questions to ask. Oh, wow. I had a different assessment is useful to say that because when you respond with I had a different assessment, it reminds people, they’re not speaking the truth. They have an assessment, right. So Why’d a different assessment? You know, my my thought is, you know, we really need to keep a base level of I don’t I’m thinking about small business 100,000 or 200,000 in the bank, right? Or it could be way more, you know, depending on or less, you know, tell me what, what’s your thinking? And, you know, what are you concerned about? or What do you care about? That has you make that assessment? Right? Maybe they care about the, you know, your money’s not making money? Or maybe they care about, you know, they’re not, there’s certain capital investments you want to make, you know, I don’t know, you know, they want to be innovative, or I don’t know, what would people care about if they thought there was much money in a business or

Paul 14:43

something I noticed is just simply asking in about somebody’s assessment. Oftentimes, you’ll notice it shift and change as they’re speaking. So we’ll just stick with that same example. Somebody says, Well, I don’t think I have enough cash. In the business, or I do have to or whatever it is and say, Well, let me ask what is what’s the thing that you’re concerned about? What do you care about that? How do you want to keep cash in the business? And then they start to articulate and say, Well, you know, I’d like to make sure I cover a couple months of payroll. And I, I also want to make sure that I can pay down the line of credit when it renews in two months. So okay, so how much is each month of payroll? And they say 20,000. And, okay, and how much is the line of credit? Well, we only owe 20, whatever and they start, they start getting facts stacked in and then suddenly, they’ll say, Well, I thought we needed 200, but we’re probably okay with 100,000. That right there, and that was not the other speaker, making a counter assessment, just asking him about what went into the assessment and as the person goes off of what I I oftentimes give the I use bodily functions maybe a little too often I heard earlier, but it’s a little bit like you just burp. And yet here we go. Yeah, yeah. Well, I can’t not do it. I just letting people know I do. Often. That’s

Cory 16:15

before we started this we Yeah, right. Are you saying that,

Paul 16:19

but it does help it stick with people because some people are just like burping like they make an assessment, and it had all the thought of like a sneeze and you go away to it and then just asking in will have people begin to ground it and see if they really believe what they’re saying, or are they just saying something they believed at one point and repeating that end assessment?

Unknown Speaker 16:39

Mm hmm. No, it’s so good. Paul. I think that if, you know, we stopped the episode right now. tremendous value in terms of asking the question, and here’s some questions you can ask. Right and then I’d like to go back a little bit to show how assessments really impact the very range of public abilities and actions that you can go after. Right? So that’s why it’s so important. But here’s some questions, you know, you want to ask a question around scope. Is it always this way? Is it just this way in this situation? Is it just this way with that person? What’s the example we were talking about earlier with the employee and the agitation?

Paul 17:20

Oh, yeah. So before the show, we were talking a little bit about getting a report about one of the executives within your company that like they are really agitating some of the direct reports that report to them and so I can’t promote them to the next level leadership in the company

Unknown Speaker 17:39

was so good. Okay, so we’re gonna use that example in a couple ways.

Paul 17:44

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Unknown Speaker 18:43

So the assessment pieces, I can’t promote them. Okay, so the first question I want to ask is about scope. Like I can’t promote them ever. I can’t promote them functionally. I can’t promote them to, you know, from a financial standpoint, a position I can’t prove Put them into a leadership role. You know what, let’s define the scope here on exactly where we can’t promote them. Okay, so that’s like one question you can ask is scope. Another question you can ask is criteria or standards, that’s when we were talking about, you know, what? what criteria are you using to determine whether or not you can promote that person? And in this case, they might say, well, they were agitating people. Okay, so your standard for promotion is if you get a report of agitation, no promotion, is that right? So just by asking that question, usually people’s flaws in their thinking, right? You might say what?

Cory 19:41

Yeah, what I’m getting is like, it’s so easy for us to make assessments that that sit like eternity in our minds, like it’s just, this is the way things are now, or this person’s gonna fit in this category permanently. But those scope kind of questions. It’s like, Oh, this is maybe not in a Every situation, and every single way, and I can look at this different that’s so, so huge.

Unknown Speaker 20:06

And you know, it’s why it’s so important. I do a lot of strategy, consulting. And it’s why it’s so important to get your assessments and strategy because, you know, if you’ve made a number of ungrounded unexamined assessments, what you go after will be limited and inappropriately put in a, you know, kind of a container. I didn’t even mean to limit yourself. Right? So we really want to ask these questions. So you have a criteria, you could even say, Okay, I get that as one criteria, yes. If, you know, the employees aren’t happy, or you know, you want to increase the morale or something, but let’s get a little bit more specific. What other criteria and you might find like, Well, you know, they have to have this they have to have that. So all of a sudden, you went from making a decision on one report with one criteria to actually looking Oh, I guess he does meet five out of the six criteria. Maybe we could just develop him in this area. Okay. is a really important piece. And then evidence, you know, what’s the evidence that either confirms or refutes your assessment? You know, so. So what you have in this example is one report. Right? So that’s one piece of evidence.

Cory 21:17

Why are those six other employees under him agitated? Is it because they’re underperforming? And he’s only trying to help them or she’s only trying to help them come around? So of course, they’re agitated because they’re having a tough time themselves. Like, where’s that information coming from?

Unknown Speaker 21:34

I mean, I think that’s a really great question too, to ask. Right, which is, well, let’s examine the report itself, you know, who gave that report? And what was their criteria for agitation because that’s a different issue here. Those are two assessments Yeah, there Yeah, agitation assessment that needs to be grounded. And there’s I can’t promote them assessment that needs to be grounded, both of which on face value will relate to spread. And make decisions based on but completely ungrounded.

Paul 22:04

Yes. So good. Well, yeah. And now I think a fun place for all of our listeners to practice this is just watching the news. Mm hmm. And just listen to one thing that is difficult about, let’s just call them news entertainers. or financial entertainers, for that matter is they are trained, like unbelievably well trained to look directly in the camera, read words written by somebody else, with a degree of sincerity and authenticity that just seems like it’s so real. Yeah. And so quickly, somebody says, this person did this to this other person. And then they’ll put in like, well, they were thinking this, or they felt this way when it happened. And it’s like, wait, we that’s not an evidence, right? We just have this thing happen. And then there’s a 30 minute show, like this thing happened with stock futures. And now there’s a 30 minute show. That’s all the assessments about the one fact or there’ll be a one of the political shows will be a set of facts that are fairly limited. And then massive amounts of assessments about what that means. And or could be new facts just created, like, this person was thinking this or felt this way when they did that when we have no evidence that they said or did those things. So it’s a good place to practice watching the news.

Unknown Speaker 23:34

Yeah, like to notice how much of the news are his facts and how much of the news is assessments? And you know, I find it very hard to find any news that is separated from the assessments. So why is this so important? Right, so let’s take a look. And you know, can I share my screen on this, I’d love to just do something real quick

Paul 23:56

and for those listening, we will do our best to distract What Carrie is doing on her screen and for those of you on YouTube, no need to do anything else. Just watch what’s about to happen.

Unknown Speaker 24:07

Yeah, good. So I’m writing the sentence with the sentence called I received was reported i i before e except after c right?

Cory 24:19

typing well, everyone’s watching. Oh, people watching

Paul 24:23

I got that’s how I fix it. I just use a different simple single syllabic word.

Unknown Speaker 24:31

I received a report. Jim, let’s call him Jim. aggravated employees.

Unknown Speaker 24:41

Okay, hmm.

Unknown Speaker 24:42

Therefore, I cannot promote him. Yep. promote him. It’s hard to think and spell so everybody, please forgive me. Okay, so there’s really two. The thing that’s so important to get is there’s two things happening in this in a sentence right? So one is factual. Okay, I received a report that Jim aggravated employees. That’s one piece. Hey, it’s factual that you received a report Now, did he actually aggravate employees, you kind of want to make a note that’s an assessment that needs to be grounded in the receiving a report. That’s fact and that the report said he aggravated employees. Okay. Now what happens with the fact? Well, it kind of stays where you got it, right. So it kind of goes into the past. I received this on Tuesday. You’re not receiving it every day you’re not receiving in the future. So it really moves into the past. It’s kind of part of history, right? facts happen and then they are part of history. Okay, I’m going to pick a different color the second part of the system, therefore, sentence, I cannot promote him, okay, or he’s not promotable. That is the assessment. So one sentence has two pieces and what happens with the assessment does it go into the past? With the fact? No, no. It actually swings into the future. And what happens when it swings into the future is here you are in the present. And you got this thing in the future called, I cannot promote them. It impacts our decisions or imagination. We no longer are with Jim at the top and our actions. So because assessments impact our decision, our imagination and our actions, we have to have assessment hygiene. We need to really be careful what assessments are allowing us to crowd our future, you know, and impact us in the present. Right. So, you know, assessments like this market is too volatile will never survive. Wow, that has me fully In the present, yeah, well, your business, and there’s two assessments too volatile and will never survive.

Cory 27:07

Yes. Well, the one that we get from the news all the time and I talk to clients about it constantly is the news anchor reads from their sheet of paper in very, very clear and concise way. The market fell today in response to x. And it’s an event that the news anchor or their team perceived as negative. And so they said, Oh, the market went down, and I see this thing that I assess is negative. So That must be why the market went down. When in reality, we don’t even know for sure that the market thinks that that thing is negative. And we don’t even know that they’re connected at all, but because they read it on the news. Oh, that must be because China did this or the President did this. Yeah, maybe

Unknown Speaker 27:54

another part of grounding assessments is looking at the authority. who’s saying this? What authority do they have, you know i, between you know, I’ve talked with couples before that take financial advice from parents who are not financially well off or love advice from parents who aren’t weren’t able to keep their marriage together? You know, so it’s like, Who’s

Unknown Speaker 28:19

behind this?

Paul 28:20

Oh, man. Yeah, they could be good advice, but you may want to check it. Well, you know, kind of in one final point here, because I just love how we’ve been able to drive this one concept around. This idea of we must ground assessments notice when others are making them question into them not in a jerk way, but as a way to better understand the other human being interacting with you. Can you share with our audience I know for those of you that have listened to Episode 73, when Kerry came on the show, and she talked a little bit about being dropped into and deployed to Kuwait as a new officer and then being forward deploy, deployed to Ballade and She was in a building where the literally there are holes in the ruse from bombs coming through like a bombed out building, literally bombed out building that they just put trailers inside of for shelter. And she walked into an already existing set of assessments. Can you share a little bit about how you broke that loose now through the lens of grounding assessments and I would highly encourage everybody go back and listen to Episode 73 also,

Unknown Speaker 29:31

yeah, that’s really good. And you know what’s even worse is those buildings were actually bomb bomb shelters.

Unknown Speaker 29:37

When holes in them

Unknown Speaker 29:41

go, Oh, yeah. who build things?

Unknown Speaker 29:47

And now I have a bombed out shelter with that trailer inside. I’m not feeling that safe.

Paul 29:52

Yeah, that’s right. Well, yeah, the bomb the bombed out bomb shelter does protect you from tornadoes and unfortunately, our folks in the Midwest But not my no country. Nope.

Cory 30:05

Thanks. Thanks for that.

Unknown Speaker 30:06

Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 30:08

Okay, so um yeah so one of the things one of the the the set of assessments were something like they all centered around well this is the way it is here. And you know what we’re only here for five months we can put up with it. So you know, it’s something to be put up with. We don’t we only get this much funding we’re we’re at the bottom of the list in terms of funding. You know, we have the old aircraft nobody cares about the C 130 II model aircraft they just care about the Jays and the ages and the new stuff right I mean, back then that was the new stuff you know so new anymore You know, but ease who even works on ease anymore. Okay, just so you guys know, that’s like very mechanical. It was the same aircraft. We flew in the Vietnam War, right. 6070 models Aircraft 70 1960 1970 Okay, so, you know, for about two months of my deployment, I really I inherited those assessments I bought into them. And that’s what most of us do is we go into our organizations or we go into an industry or we go somewhere new and we want to find out what’s so you know, we want to learn so you have to watch what you’re learning You know, you’re when you simply take on and inherit others assessments. You’re not doing the critical thinking around that and all of a sudden, you’re gonna think just like they do. So in the middle of his deployment, what happened for me Actually, the the truth of the matter is, is when I did get for deployed to and from Kuwait, and I got four deployments blood, so now all of a sudden the war was here in front of me, you know, I was the, you know, alarms would sound and I had, you know, hunker down and and, you know, I was in the war in quake. We weren’t I mean, that’s where the Marines go for r&r. Right? Like, it’s not the same as Iraq. So I had and I won’t go too much into it here, you can listen to a different, you know, go back to that episode. But I had an experience where what we were doing became so much more meaningful, the maintenance we were doing prior to that, if the aircraft weren’t ready, you know, or we were having mechanical issues. I gave the higher ups the litany of reasons which were really kind of opinions and assessments for why we couldn’t do what we were supposed to do. And you know, what’s even worse is they took that and they accepted that they didn’t ground my assessments. And I was like the queen of this stuff so much so I got an award for being like the top officer. The base with the lowest performance was pretty unreal as leaders how we are so appeased and pacified by smart sounding assessments. Yeah. Yeah. So. So here we were. And and when I came back from my, from my forward deployment into Ballade and things were much more meaningful for me, I began to question a lot of things. I began to see assessments as assessments, you know, as these aren’t really grounded, it’s just what we’re saying. Who says we’re the bottom on the list for funding? Who says nobody cares, like who actually said, Nobody cares about the model. Right. And then I started questioning who determined that having a trailer in a bombed out building was a better decision than building a new building on this acre of land that’s right next to this motel. And, and I had to take into account authority because it was a fairly low ranking person that said, Oh, yeah, you sucks they give us this trailer inside the thing. It was like a taken for granted. So I did ask I started to ground that assessment, right. So I asked my officers, you know, what’s the set of criteria that would have to be in place to allow us to build a building on that acre, right? That’s unused? They said, Oh, I don’t know. We’ve never asked, oh, why are Why don’t we build a trailer inside of this bombed out building? I don’t know, just like this when we showed up. So like, a few weeks, we were already putting in for funding to build a new building with toilets which is cool. running water, which is internet very cool. And, you know, within six months, you know, we had five and a half million dollar. It was the you know, it didn’t take much actually. So all these assessments were ungrounded and we’re impacting the variable nature of what we took on as a as a meat?

Paul 35:04

Well, I I think that is the perfect place for us to stop for people to be able to walk away thinking about grounding their assessments and how often assessments are being made all around us that we may be accepting as facts, when in fact, what we may need to do is just question in, which could mean as much as just questioning in to change an entire Forward Operating airbase? Or what it might mean to question in and change a culture of a company or question in and change a customer’s relationship to your offer forever. Carrie, thank you so much for being here.

Unknown Speaker 35:42

Hey, you are welcome. One really quick hint, do it with curiosity, genuine curiosity, not I gotcha. Okay, so it’s a way better for you if you’re at if you’re genuinely curious about the assessment, rather than I’m going to find out where this doesn’t work,

Paul 35:59

yet. Yes, well and for all of you who want to stay in touch with Carrie who wants to be able to hear additional updates from leadership impact the other podcasts that Carrie and I co host together, you can reach her at the Granger network.com. And you can find that podcast. Granger network comm is what I meant to say. And you can reach her Of course on LinkedIn, all the socials and of course follow and subscribe to leadership impact. It makes a difference for other people being able to get the importance of that information inside their organizations. And it gives you a great tool you can actually push out to your leadership team to help them further their leadership impact also, and as always, core and I help that for all of you, and all the listeners of your business, your wealth, all the clients of sound financial group that this has been a contribution to you being able to design a building

Cory 37:09

This is how legends are made.

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